Who are the "DOGS", men or women?

I was talking to my friend today. Yesterday he told me he was going to be hanging out with this married chick who he has messed around with in the past. I told him it was a lost cause, that she was doing nothing more than using him as an intimacy surrogate, and that it wasn't worth his time to put any more effort into trying to hit it.

I was right on the money.

So we were talking a little more about this, and it turns out that one of the ways this chick justifies her behavior is because she TOLD her husband that she wanted to "make out" with my friend, and he basically said "go ahead". Not sure exactly how all of this came up, but I'm assuming that she was using it as ammunition in an argument.

So this chick uses my friend as a way to take shots at her husband, then she justifies USING MY FRIEND to get what she is missing at home by taking what her husband said LITERALLY when I am sure it wasn't intended that way.

What a selfish b!tch!

And I like the girl. She's nice. But when i step back and look at what is going on, she is unabashedly USING two men. It pisses me off cause I similar situations playing out all the time.

Eventually our conversation moved to a girl I was seeing last year. It seems that although there was never any talk of exclusivity, and I PERSONALLY thought it was a casual thing, evidently the girl thought of it as a little bit more.

So I started thinking about that situation too.

Basically, I am still friends with this girl's best friend. She has helped me out in the past, and I owe her to this day. We hang out once every couple of weeks or so.

But I got to thinking. The chick I was seeing THOUGHT we had "something". Her friend even told me so. But despite this fact, she started seeing someone back in her hometown, who she "left me" for.

I stopped for a second and thought about what would have happened if the roles were reversed. What if I were the one who started seeing another chick and left this girl? I would be a grade "A" ASS HOLE. Neither her nor her friend would likely speak with me ever again. I would be labeled as a "dog" and serve as confirmation that all men suck.

But since it's NOT reversed, I am still friends with this girls best friend, and I am still cool with the girl I dated.

Oh yea, then there's this other girl that these women work with, who is fukking a married guy at the office. Does she get any flack for that? No, of course not. It's ok for a woman to engage in such behavior, but if these girls found out that my friend was trying to have sex with a married chick she would have a fit, further confirmation that "All men are dogs".

The double standard is almost sickening.

After all you've seen in your life, and all the stuff you've read here, WHY are you even the least bit concerned about all these women acting this way? THAT'S WHAT THEY DO. Maybe it's unfair. I certainly used to think it was. But so what? It's real life.

But you know the score, STR8UP. You ALREADY know they do this, but it seems like when you see it again or hear another story, you get pissed off ALL OVER AGAIN.

Accept. This is how it is. Once you truly accept it -- really deep down, not just intellectually --- then you'll be ok with it. And life is so much better when that happens.

Women are women. People are people. They DO stuff.

Most people I know are never ok with a married person disrespecting their vows, whether they are a man or a woman. So I can't relate to that phenomenon you seem to keep experiencing.

I'm not saying it's "OK."

I am against breaking of marriage vows. And I never did when I was married.

I'm just surprised that STR8UP is surprised to hear this stuff.

It's HORRIBLY common.

aliasguy said:

But you know the score, STR8UP. You ALREADY know they do this, but it seems like when you see it again or hear another story, you get pissed off ALL OVER AGAIN.

Accept. This is how it is. Once you truly accept it -- really deep down, not just intellectually --- then you'll be ok with it. And life is so much better when that happens.

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Of course you know that I already know the score, but every time I think about it all it does is bring back the question "So how does one ever expect to have a decent relationship"? And then I wonder why i would even want one AT ALL.

Not that I am seeking anything, but I know how good it can feel, and I love to experience that feeling, but man, why even bother? You basically fail or you get lucky, cause even if you're 100% DJ 100% of the time, you still have to have a girl who is a WOMAN, and you never know when she might change on you.

It's just rough out there, and it doesn't look like things will be changing any time soon.

iqqi said:

Most people I know are never ok with a married person disrespecting their vows, whether they are a man or a woman. So I can't relate to that phenomenon you seem to keep experiencing.

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His social circle consists of strippers, SWINGERS, drunks, sluts, cheaters, thieves (e.g. his best friend stealing over 100K from him), and drug addicts.

What can we expect? Well...a doom perspective about life. That's what can we expect from a man that surrounds himself with mud and filth.

aliasguy said:

It's HORRIBLY common.

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I know, and that's what's disheartening about it all. It's EVERYWHERE I look! Why would I think that I am so special as to be able to avoid it?

I was married for a long time. Was involved with another woman that I consider LTR. And now have another for the last 6 months. ALL 3 showed respect for me.

Note: I also have my share of "short" term relationships (e.g. FWB) and one-night-stands. I was not great husband...but have found some great woman. They are there....you just have to hang in the right places. If you fish in the sewer, you will always find SH-IT. Fish somewhere else.

Latinoman said:

His social circle consists of strippers, SWINGERS, drunks, sluts, cheaters, thieves (e.g. his best friend stealing over 100K from him), and drug addicts.

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Not true, that's a cheap shot, and I would expect a more constructive reply from you.

Alias, you see the same things I do. Is it because you only hang out with scumbags too?

STR8UP said:

I know, and that's what's disheartening about it all. It's EVERYWHERE I look! Why would I think that I am so special as to be able to avoid it?

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Maybe you should be looking in different places.

You will only be special enough to avoid it when you become special enough to select someone as special as you.

TO start: Can you honestly say you would never be unfaithful?

Actually, I EXPECT that kind of reply from you, but I always HOPE for something different.

iqqi said:

TO start: Can you honestly say you would never be unfaithful?

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I will never make that claim, but I will say that I have been faithful to every woman i have been with to this day. And I can guarantee you that women I have been with have done 20x more "inappropriate" things than I ever did when I was involved with them.

In the rhetorical sense, I dont believe "Dog" knows any gender.

People in general can be conniving, manipulative and selfish.

Thing is though, when you get burned badly by a woman, you are more sensitive and aware of the b!tches. You still haven't forgiven the one that wronged you and anything that reminds you of her betrayal makes you furious

After reading what your ex did to you, I'd be pissed too. At some point though, you have to honestly forgive her and move on.

Well, I'm off to a party with a bunch of strippers, druggies, slvts, drunks, swingers, cheaters, and thieves.

Actually it's a birthday party that a bunch of professionals will be attending, but I'm sure no one believes me!

STR8UP said:

And I can guarantee you that women I have been with have done 20x more "inappropriate" things than I ever did when I was involved with them.

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Do NOT fish in the sewer...the best you might find there is cat-fish and we know what that eats.

Fish in a better pond. There you can probably catch salmon and the likes.

Change your social circle. You live in Florida...go to Dancing Classes during your time off. Go to a Conference for entrepeneurs (like yourself). Stop seeking the EASY road...the EASY women...nothing great comes from there.

STR8UP said:

Well, I'm off to a party with a bunch of strippers, druggies, slvts, drunks, swingers, cheaters, and thieves.

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I'm pretty sure you are joking, and thats a good sign. Laugh it up.. have fun and do whatever it takes to get you over the hump.

Eventually though, you will need to face your anger and the emptiness from which you are trying to escape.

A radical change of environment/social circle would do wonders for you. The company you keep says more about you than you know.

It doesn't MATTER where you look, it's going on. (Even down at church.) Not everyone, of course, but a LOT.

STR8UP, you're getting close to a true understanding. Your post about wanting a "decent" relationship makes me want to say:

A decent relationship is a wonderful thing. What you EXPECT from the relationship is irrelevant, because it will play out as it does. EXPECTING good behavior from your partner does not guarantee she will act in that way. You can express to her your "expectations," if you want. Or not. But she's going to do whatever she wants to do. If that includes bad behavior, you won't find out until "too late."

You CANNOT count on anyone. You take the good with the bad. Sometimes, they are wonderful women - faithful, giving, loving understanding. Sometimes, they are more typical. All you can do is enjoy the women for who they are. (Don't women always say 'Love me for who I am"?) The good times are good; the bad stuff sucks. It's just life. Accept.

Here's the kicker-----> We men are generally just as bad.


Life is as life is.

I have to ask why do you keep making your threads so general. You keep posting these stories about some trifling biotch, but then instead of saying "is this trifling biotch a dog or what" you say "whos the dogs, men or women".

This is a trend of your recent posts, and what this trend is telling me is that every bad thing that you witness, you are LOOKING to attribute it to the whole gender.

You keep doing that, and you wont find anyone special.

A woman who cheats on her husband does not dictate that all women are dogs.

A woman who is faithful to a man no matter what does not dictate that all women are angels.

It is all a question of individual morality.

You have to find someone whose moral view points align with your own. It's hard. But is surely impossible if you are looking to write the whole gender off, (or on), based on individual's actions.

aliasguy said:

It doesn't MATTER where you look, it's going on. (Even down at church.) Not everyone, of course, but a LOT.

STR8UP, you're getting close to a true understanding. Your post about wanting a "decent" relationship makes me want to say:

A decent relationship is a wonderful thing. What you EXPECT from the relationship is irrelevant, because it will play out as it does. EXPECTING good behavior from your partner does not guarantee she will act in that way. You can express to her your "expectations," if you want. Or not. But she's going to do whatever she wants to do. If that includes bad behavior, you won't find out until "too late."

You CANNOT count on anyone. You take the good with the bad. Sometimes, they are wonderful women - faithful, giving, loving understanding. Sometimes, they are more typical. All you can do is enjoy the women for who they are. (Don't women always say 'Love me for who I am"?) The good times are good; the bad stuff sucks. It's just life. Accept.

Here's the kicker-----> We men are generally just as bad.


Life is as life is.

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Good point. But let's put ourselves in the eyes of the "Good woman". Would a "Good Woman" go out with a man that associates himself with shaddy people?

Sure...there is sh_it floating in the BEST of ponds too. But here is a fact...finding a GOOD FISH in the SEWER is almost an impossibility.

STR8UP said:

Well, I'm off to a party with a bunch of strippers, druggies, slvts, drunks, swingers, cheaters, and thieves.

Actually it's a birthday party that a bunch of professionals will be attending, but I'm sure no one believes me!

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And I wish I was in FL. It's a cold snap here tonight and already in the single digits tonight with wind. This is a reare Saturday night that I probably won't bother going out in.

I see iqqi totally missed your point about women having a double standard and she's using the quality woman argument again. The argument that i thought we dispelled awhile back already.