Love: The Product of Circumstance (and $$)

I'd like everyone to approach this discussion with an open mind. I also urge you to read everything before responding.

I'd like to point out that everything you're about to read is related to long term relationships, not hooking up. Picking up girls is easy once you get the basics and focus on a little bit of self improvement. Keeping a girl around (should you choose to) is much more complicated. I believe that we as human beings do search for a long term partner. Some get married before they're 20, others go through life dating tons of girls but never finding one to suit them (for whatever reasons), and then there's everyone in-between. But I believe that ultimately, we seek a family structure. When it happens and how is beyond the scope of this piece, but nature intended for us to procreate and the highest chance for offspring survival is a long term union of the two sexes commonly known as a family.

It recently hit me (pretty hard too) that within the realm of long term relationships, love is nothing more than the product of circumstance, in particular financial stability. Let me explain. If I've learned anything, it's that although there are many many factors involved in long term attraction, there are two that are searched for since the caveman days first and foremost.

Men seek physical beauty.

Women seek security and stability.

Needless to say there are many other factors. For a girl, the man should look presentable, be confident, sense of humor, etc etc. But the biggest, most influential factor to a woman seeking a long term relationship is his ability to provide security and stability. In the caveman days before there was money, it meant seeking out the biggest/toughest/bravest/whatever male who would hunt food, provide shelter, and kill anyone or anything threatening their livelihood. Within the scope of LTRs, that was alpha. Nowadays we don't have to hunt food, but the principle remains. Money is the means by which we now achieve security and stability. Everyone wants to live comfortably. So, money = security and stability = the basis for long term attraction.

For men there are many factors as well when seeking a long term partner. Genetically the most influential factor is how good she looks. Other things like a sense of humor, intelligence, thinking for herself, etc all play in, but I seriously doubt anyone here would be all gung-ho for an extremely funny, intelligent, FAT unattractive chick. So, looks are primary for men. Regardless of your current situation, you (as a man) have to be at least somewhat physically attracted to a long term partner. Granted you'll probably be more willing to settle for an intelligent, funny, successful HB8 than a retarded HB9, but it still goes to illustrate the point that looks are primary for long term attraction to a man - the only variable is to what degree.

So how does this all play into love?

Women, especially once they get into their 20s and get out into the real world typically start seeking a long term partner and provider. The process can be a long one depending on the woman's qualifications and this is why some people think that girls at clubs and bars are just out to have fun and nothing else. When you look a little deeper, you'll realize that biologically women don't stand to benefit from having multiple sex partners and there's always another motive. The male imperative is to spread his seed, but once a woman is impregnated it's game over. Her imperative is to find a suitable long term provider for her and her offspring.

So it may be the case that you played the game well and ended up sleeping with a girl. Good for you. It may have been great for her too, but she would NEVER sleep with a guy she didn't see (even if only subconsciously on the genetic level) as a long term provider. Yes you can be broke as hell and still land chicks, but that's due entirely to the fact that she doesn't know your situation and you gave off a positive first impression. If you walked up to a girl and said "hi, I'm broke, I drive a sh!tty car (or no car at all), and I live in my parent's basement", I don't care how hot you are or how much game you have, you're not gonna get any. It's easy to fool someone at first, but eventually it all comes out. The only exception to this are cheating wives or any other woman who already has her primary needs (security and stability) met.

To further that, if a woman sees potential in you, she will stick around ... for a while. You can be broke but if you're actively doing something to improve your situation (and she sees it), she'll give you the benefit of the doubt and support you ... but again only for a while. You have to have something to show.

Love as a Product of Circumstance

After you've been with a person for a while, you begin to develop strong feelings for them. As with any natural progression in life, eventually you have to take it to the next level. This is called falling in love. The long bonding process is what creates these deep emotional (and spiritual) feelings for the other person.

However, in order for this process to advance, circumstances must be met. A girl will only stick around with you for so long before realizing you won't be a good provider. You can be extremely good looking, a natural comedian, have ultra tight game, dress impeccably, be amazing in bed, but NONE of that will keep a girl long term.

We live in a material world and the harsh reality of it is that money is at the root of everything. A girl will be way more willing and excited to have you *** all over her face if she knows you'll be able to support her should something happen.

Now, this doesn't mean she's a gold digger and you don't have to be Mr.Gates to get the girl you've always wanted. You just have to be financially secure and stable. The #1 requirement for long term intimacy, remember?

What about everything else?

Some of you are probably thinking "well what if I made a ton of cash but I was still a fat slob munching on cheetos playing WoW and never going out and socializing ... I'd never get a girl then!". No you wouldn't. But the thing is, unless you were a bum off the street who just won the lottery, that would be impossible in the first place. Take a look at anyone who's loaded, or at least living comfortably. Sure some may have been at the right place at the right time, but even then you have to have certain characteristics which allow you to remain and progress up the chain. Company CEOs, rock stars, etc may not always be the most physically "alpha", but they're tough as nails. You don't get rich that easy. And surprisingly, all of the characteristics required to be financially stable are also secondary characteristics which women seek. Things like confidence, ambition, dedication, social skills, etc. You don't have to be GQ to get a girl. As long as you're average and have the means to support yourself and her (should the need arise), you'll have girls coming to you. And if you're rich but just ok looking, your wife will still NOT cheat on you with some "hunk" if she knows that you'd leave her ass in the dust if you found out. Money trumps everything.

Conclusion

So, love is a product of circumstance. If you ask someone why they love another person, they'll never say "it's because he/she is rich" and they'll be telling the truth. They love the person due to their other characteristics (he/she is ambitious, confident, funny, etc). However, that love (the lengthy bonding that takes place) wouldn't flourish in the first place unless the #1 prerequisite for the woman was met: stability and security. And in today's world, that means $$.

So if you want to keep bangin all the hot chicks at clubs/bars/whatever, you can still be broke and living at home. There's more than enough content here to get you laid. But once you find one you'd like to keep around, you better get your sh!t together or she'll kick you to the curb.

Money makes the world go around. Don't ever forget it.

Very, very, VERY good post my friend. You are starting to get it.

It's not so much that women are gold diggers that want to be taken care of.. it's in a womans' nature to make sure she is provided for.

Keeping a girl around (should you choose to) is much more complicated.

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Keeping women around is difficult for some because they built the foundation of the relationship on a lie. If you pretend to be this confident guy who loves such and such, and aren't, it's only so long you can put up the game.

If you take a woman out to eat on the first 3 dates, and you have a GREAT time, you can't go out to eat every night for the rest of your life.

That's why it's essentintal to find a woman that not only fits you, you find her being you. I make it known I am a horse racing nut from jump street, becasue if it's a problem it needs to be a prpoblem now, becuse we arent going to get anywhere. I need to know what you like, what you dont' like. Are you athletic? Do you mind working out? Can you swim (a must for me)? What do you like to do for fun?

Long=short, men need to do more qualifying on dates, and less trying to qualify themselves TO dates.

I believe that we as human beings do search for a long term partner. Some get married before they're 20, others go through life dating tons of girls but never finding one to suit them (for whatever reasons), and then there's everyone in-between.

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I would consider myself somewhat of a successful person. I know pepole who are more successful than I am. Financially and otherwise. All of us have the same thing in common when it comes to women. Every last person I know... Women aren't the end all be all.

Half of the people here make their live moves, in regards to what will get them women. Once I found out what it was I loved, that was it. Everything revolves around that. Even now. Finding a passion in life will keep you on the straight and narrow. it iwll keep you from being 21 years old and having a wife, 2 kids and your wife is now bannging her boss at Best Buy and blaming you for it. It iwll keep you out of clubs night after night, doing the same pointless ass routines and patting yourself on the back because a woman, who has just as low self esteem as you do, found you witty and "gave you some"



Love, relationship wise, is a product of circumstances. The reason I say.. I don't love my GF...I realy like her. I care for her alot. but if you lined up every woman on earth, I can gurantee you she woudlnt' be the one I would choose. Therefore because of circumstances, she's the best of what i have available at this time, so hince, the circumstances.

So how does this all play into love?

Women, especially once they get into their 20s and get out into the real world typically start seeking a long term partner and provider. The process can be a long one depending on the woman's qualifications and this is why some people think that girls at clubs and bars are just out to have fun and nothing else. When you look a little deeper, you'll realize that biologically women don't stand to benefit from having multiple sex partners and there's always another motive. The male imperative is to spread his seed, but once a woman is impregnated it's game over. Her imperative is to find a suitable long term provider for her and her offspring.

So it may be the case that you played the game well and ended up sleeping with a girl. Good for you. It may have been great for her too, but she would NEVER sleep with a guy she didn't see (even if only subconsciously on the genetic level) as a long term provider. Yes you can be broke as hell and still land chicks, but that's due entirely to the fact that she doesn't know your situation and you gave off a positive first impression. If you walked up to a girl and said "hi, I'm broke, I drive a sh!tty car (or no car at all), and I live in my parent's basement", I don't care how hot you are or how much game you have, you're not gonna get any. It's easy to fool someone at first, but eventually it all comes out. The only exception to this are cheating wives or any other woman who already has her primary needs (security and stability) met.

To further that, if a woman sees potential in you, she will stick around ... for a while. You can be broke but if you're actively doing something to improve your situation (and she sees it), she'll give you the benefit of the doubt and support you ... but again only for a while. You have to have something to show.[/quote[

I could write a 200 page book on this.

First, I can't say it loud enough, even though no one will hear me.. Trust me when I say take care of yoruself first. WOMEN AREN'T GOING ANYWHERE!!!. Get your finances in order.Get your **** in order. Get your life in order. Why are you working harder than you have to , to get women? You don't even have to be loaded.. get in shape, read a book or two, learn to do something worhtwhile. hell I'm 24 and I don't think Im going ot hit my prime for another 10 years!!
with that said.., all of the women, for the most part, I knew when I was in high school and tried to date then, I know, for better or for worse now. dont' necessarly talk to them, but tey have my number/email address/whatever.

I hvae seen first hand the attitude of women change.

From my oneitis being a party girl who hung out with friends and wouldn't give me the time of day, to finding herself in a serious relationship with a guy whoose parents were loaded, and when it became apparant he wasn't doing anything with his life, and she couldn't have been more wrong in who she choose to shack up with, suddnely find me "so attractive", wanting to "keep in touch" and sending me pictures of her, asking to come visit me, braging about all the guys that are attracted to her.



Alot of pepole, even here, think it's a hell of alot easier to get ass if you have money. and I'd be lying if I said it didnt' give me a leg up.. but you have to be more cautius. Contary to belief, you just cna't pull up and throw money everywhere, because eveyr woman in the room would look at you, and you couldn't deciefer the true owmen from the gold diggers.

Actually, believe it or not, I follow for the most part, the DJ Bible on first dates verbatium.

But the fact is, I am who I am. I can't be successful, then get mad at women, for liking me, for being successful.

Past examples that have gone bad that are woman who have been to my house and then expecting every date to be at a 4 star restrant.... that's not a woman you want around. I like nice stuff.. but you aren't enjoying me for me, you are enjoying my money. The ones who throw hints that bills need to be paid, like they are doing me a favor by fvcking me.

my GF now.. I'm not dumb and she's not either. I know part of the reason she is attracted to me ist hat I can provide for her. Now.. she doesn't ASK for anything, and won't ask for anything, but it's there. But I also know that if I were an *******, or didn't have my @@@@ in order, she wouldn't be here either.


YOu are for the most part spot on. You can't focus on someone else, until you are taken care of. That's a conecpet that will fly over alto of people's heads, and they want it SOOO Bad they will patch up problems instead of fix them.. but trust me when i Say, do it right. learn, get your stuff together, the quality of woman you get in your life that wants to be with you, short and logn term, will skyrocket.

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Take a look at anyone who's loaded, or at least living comfortably. Sure some may have been at the right place at the right time, but even then you have to have certain characteristics which allow you to remain and progress up the chain. Company CEOs, rock stars, etc may not always be the most physically "alpha", but they're tough as nails.

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also wanted to hit on this. I knew at a pretty early age I was different from most people. not different smart, not different good looking, not different whatever. Different Stuff made me tick. In high school I thought I was "odd".

things that i notice about me that I are differnt.. is I don't quit chasing somehting I want. I would literarly die chasing something I wanted if I wanted it bad enough. And that's not necessarly healthly.. it cna be great if harnessed.. but that's what scared me so much about the coke habit I had as well... becuse I know my personality. Regardless of how many time I have been rejected, turned down or just loss. That is the sole reason I had so much trouble with my oneitis.. I didn't want her because she was that damn good of a woman, i wanted her because of my desire to "achieve a goal", which at the time, was to get her. all the talk, even if not mostly here about "you just need to move on" just made it worse, becuause I had to prove eveyrone wrong.. it took me realizing, she wasn't a catch therefore not worthc hasing, to move on. So it works both ways. That relentness helped me get where I am, but it also has caused me great pain in my life.

although I would imagine it's good now, I don't too much care about how I'm precieved. 5 years ago i was waling around with holes in my shoes, eating ramon noodles and could care less, because I had a goal that I wanted to achieve and as long as I was chasing it, the ends justifed the means. Most people are too concerned with how they are precieved to risk anything significant. That struggling puts you though a lot so yes, toughness is there. You've just been though what more than the avg person has had to.

and yes that is an attractive trait to women. when you take charge and you don't act confident, you are confident in a situtatoin, because you've been though worse, and you can honeslty look her in the eye and comfort her and promise her everthing is going to be okay, because "i've got this".

It's not just the money, it's the character you build along the way in the pursuit of money that are just as important. Passion, drive, ambition, confidence, will power. Thoose are things that literarly drive women wild.

When I was explaining to my Gf my new Ideas for my website I'm building, she couldn't help but get excited,b ecause I was about to jump though the roof!! And it's not a questoin of if it's going ot work.. it's going to work, because I'm me and it will get done. What woman doesn't like that about a man?

Money won't buy you love but it'll pay for the search...

reading this I remember a book where a king dressed up as a begger to find his true love, because all the other girls would just want him for his money.
But ofcourse there was this one girl who loved him for what he was and you can pretty much guess the rest of the book

Except "the girl of your dreams" (and whatever qualities she possesses) won't be falling in love with a beggar.

As I said in the original post (and not to be misinterepreted), it's not necessarily the money that she falls in love with; it's her need for security and stability as well as all of the secondary characteristics that she falls in love with, which is a product financial success.

I'm curious to hear some of other opinions on this. Maybe Rollo could comment?

backbreaker said:

although I would imagine it's good now, I don't too much care about how I'm precieved. 5 years ago i was waling around with holes in my shoes, eating ramon noodles and could care less, because I had a goal that I wanted to achieve and as long as I was chasing it, the ends justifed the means. Most people are too concerned with how they are precieved to risk anything significant. That struggling puts you though a lot so yes, toughness is there. You've just been though what more than the avg person has had to.

and yes that is an attractive trait to women. when you take charge and you don't act confident, you are confident in a situtatoin, because you've been though worse, and you can honeslty look her in the eye and comfort her and promise her everthing is going to be okay, because "i've got this".

It's not just the money, it's the character you build along the way in the pursuit of money that are just as important. Passion, drive, ambition, confidence, will power. Thoose are things that literarly drive women wild.

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What is it you do, man? I'd like to learn more about how people like you think. I seem to have mental blocks in a bunch of places. Can you tell us more about how you discovered what it is that you "love" and how you became inspired to achieve it?

You'll lose money chasing women but you'll never lose women chasing money.

--some Don Juan

squirrels said:

What is it you do, man? I'd like to learn more about how people like you think. I seem to have mental blocks in a bunch of places. Can you tell us more about how you discovered what it is that you "love" and how you became inspired to achieve it?

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squirrls, you've been here longer than I have!! you single handedly slapped my ass in gear when I was dealing with my old oneitis 3 YEARS ago.

I can't put a title on what I do..stuff.lol, in honesty, I'm a professional handciapper that's now branching out to start a breeding/racing stable and at the same time working to start a horse racing news/business/forum/blog/photo/video/betting website.

Man I grew up at the horse track. Every saturday like clockwork, my dad would take me to get a haircut... then the 40 mintue drive to oaklawn when it was open. I couldn't sleep the night before.

I just love it. even when I had my computer company (which is what i was doing when you slapped me out of gear) horse racing was always my first love, I just didnt' have the balls to chase it.

You can't develop passion for osmething. you know what it is you are passionate about when you find it. maybe you just havnet found it yet. I'm lucky enough to have found it.

Well muscleman's statement would explain why Sir Paul McCartney and Heather Mills got together and married, but not why they split up.

Ben MacDui said:

Well muscleman's statement would explain why Sir Paul McCartney and Heather Mills got together and married, but not why they split up.

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I just looked up who Heather Mills is on wiki. Check this out:

While she was engaged to be married to Chris Terrill, a film maker, she met Sir Paul and abandoned her fiancé only days before the wedding.

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haha.

As for muscelman's theory not covering why they split up, I think his theory only concerns the perspective of women--that is, what a man must do in the eyes of a woman in order to be kept by her. Obviously muscleman's theory does not concern itself with what a woman must do in order to keep a man. In this case, I'm guessing the novelty factor wore off for MCcartney and he proceeded to ditch her without remorse.

backbreaker said:

squirrls, you've been here longer than I have!! you single handedly slapped my ass in gear when I was dealing with my old oneitis 3 YEARS ago.

I can't put a title on what I do..stuff.lol, in honesty, I'm a professional handciapper that's now branching out to start a breeding/racing stable and at the same time working to start a horse racing news/business/forum/blog/photo/video/betting website.

Man I grew up at the horse track. Every saturday like clockwork, my dad would take me to get a haircut... then the 40 mintue drive to oaklawn when it was open. I couldn't sleep the night before.

I just love it. even when I had my computer company (which is what i was doing when you slapped me out of gear) horse racing was always my first love, I just didnt' have the balls to chase it.

You can't develop passion for osmething. you know what it is you are passionate about when you find it. maybe you just havnet found it yet. I'm lucky enough to have found it.

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LOL...I think I might've just "grown up too fast" as far as SoSuave goes. Had some early success, figured a bunch of things out, and never took the time to develop the discipline and self-confidence.

I felt better 4 years ago. I was a different person. But I never truly BELIEVED I was that person...I always felt like I was "scamming" women with the whole Don Juan act. But sometimes I even convinced myself.

I think I found out a lot of things before I was ready to receive them, and now I'm judging myself by a standard I'm not prepared for...and beating myself up as a result.

You're right that I need to find my passion...there are things I'm very into, but none of them the kinds of things that make money or attract women.

Patience is not something I ever developed.

i hear you loud and clear. I remember the first day I found this site... saying "in 2 months I will have this wome thing down pack!!"

yeah.. that was 5 years ago. Am I better wtih women? god yes. however it took me forgetting women existed and focusing on myself, and taking the time to digest the information on this site to really get anywhere.

^ I'm kind of feeling that way myself. I've been here for a while and even though I improved with women and I know a lot more about how things work, I still feel like I've been faking a lot of it. I mean really deep down, I've questioned myself (especially with this past relationship) - why is she with me? What do I bring to the table? And I know I'm good looking, funny, smart, all that crap, but the conclusion I came to is that all of that is secondary to being a provider.

I'm not trying to kick myself, but analyzing the past 8 months I realize that my last relationship was, like you said, built on a lie. And she stuck with me for a long time hoping things would improve - and they didn't. I wouldn't even blame her if she was bitter at me for the whole thing. It's actually funny because it's similar to the girl you mentioned in your situation. She is a bit (not much, but a little) of a party girl, and yes my parents are well off. She's been on her own for a long time and her parents, although not poor, aren't in nearly the same financial situation as mine. So she stuck around, then realized that, sad to say, I wasn't really doing anything with my life. I mean, I had goals and ambitions and all that, but I never really focused on them. I always figured "I could do it tomorrow" - for the past 8 months. I thought to myself "hey well I have this girl she's great, I can slowly work on getting stuff together when I feel like it, nothing to worry about". I couldn't have been more wrong.

Daring your GF to leave and her sticking around regardless is pretty awesome power - power that only a solid provider (in her eyes) would have. I'm sure it's power we'd all like to harness as well.

As for McCartney, I'm not sure he's the best example to use. Keep in mind he was married for 29 years before his wife died of cancer. For most, that's half a lifetime. I can't imagine having a normal relationship after something like that.

Now you mentioned forgetting women existed and focusing on yourself. Since you say you've been through it, can you elaborate a bit more? I know not to get seriously involved anymore until I have my stuff figured out and I'm certainly not the type to spend my time going out to bars/clubs picking up chicks (just not my thing), but the desire is of course still there. Not sure how to handle that.

muscleman said:

^ I'm kind of feeling that way myself. I've been here for a while and even though I improved with women and I know a lot more about how things work, I still feel like I've been faking a lot of it. I mean really deep down, I've questioned myself (especially with this past relationship) - why is she with me? What do I bring to the table? And I know I'm good looking, funny, smart, all that crap, but the conclusion I came to is that all of that is secondary to being a provider.

I'm not trying to kick myself, but analyzing the past 8 months I realize that my last relationship was, like you said, built on a lie. And she stuck with me for a long time hoping things would improve - and they didn't. I wouldn't even blame her if she was bitter at me for the whole thing. It's actually funny because it's similar to the girl you mentioned in your situation. She is a bit (not much, but a little) of a party girl, and yes my parents are well off. She's been on her own for a long time and her parents, although not poor, aren't in nearly the same financial situation as mine. So she stuck around, then realized that, sad to say, I wasn't really doing anything with my life. I mean, I had goals and ambitions and all that, but I never really focused on them. I always figured "I could do it tomorrow" - for the past 8 months. I thought to myself "hey well I have this girl she's great, I can slowly work on getting stuff together when I feel like it, nothing to worry about". I couldn't have been more wrong.

Daring your GF to leave and her sticking around regardless is pretty awesome power - power that only a solid provider (in her eyes) would have. I'm sure it's power we'd all like to harness as well.

As for McCartney, I'm not sure he's the best example to use. Keep in mind he was married for 29 years before his wife died of cancer. For most, that's half a lifetime. I can't imagine having a normal relationship after something like that.

Now you mentioned forgetting women existed and focusing on yourself. Since you say you've been through it, can you elaborate a bit more? I know not to get seriously involved anymore until I have my stuff figured out and I'm certainly not the type to spend my time going out to bars/clubs picking up chicks (just not my thing), but the desire is of course still there. Not sure how to handle that.

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nothing really to add on.. i just said fvck women, I'm focusing on me. and I did. women aren't all that damn important, which is my theme song on this site. focus on you, find things you like, find things you love, and you will be all the better in the long run for it

just another newb?? said:

reading this I remember a book where a king dressed up as a begger to find his true love, because all the other girls would just want him for his money.
But ofcourse there was this one girl who loved him for what he was and you can pretty much guess the rest of the book

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muscleman said:

Except "the girl of your dreams" (and whatever qualities she possesses) won't be falling in love with a beggar.

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Due to past successes I have enough money and live simple enough that I don’t have to work and rarely do, except in my garden. I live in what is little more than a shack on the edge of a wilderness area just out side of town. (I got the idea from Thoreau) I ride my $100 bicycle to get around and almost never drive. I’m never in a hurry. When people ask what I do, I tell them that I am a bum, which is technically true, except that I bathe most days.

Living this way I have had four relationships lasting more than a year, I’ve been with my current girlfriend for about three and a half years. She is the girl of my dreams. All of these women have careers and make more money than I get from my savings/investments.

I don’t think that money is the deciding factor. There are a few couples that I know who are poor and their bond is as strong as can be. I guess it all depends. My girlfriend is one of those who claims that she would pick true love over a million dollars any day. Not all women are materialistic.

When I’m hanging out under the trees with my girlfriend, smoking a little weed, listening to the birds sing, the sun streaming through the forest canopy, a gentle breeze upon my skin it’s priceless, and I don’t even have a MasterCard.

You don’t need a lot of money to offer physical and emotional security to a woman.

muscleman said:

And if you're rich but just ok looking, your wife will still But once you find one you'd like to keep around, you better get your sh!t together or she'll kick you to the curb.

Money makes the world go around. Don't ever forget it.

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If this is true, how do you explain all the loser guys that sit around and smoke pot and play guitar and video games all day while their girlfriends work 3 jobs to support them? Not only will they not leave these guys who have shown no sign of attaining any kind of a future over the course of often several years, but they will make themselves miserable busting their asses supporting the very hobbies their men indulge in which they hate.

This is very common. I know a lot of hot girls who break themselves for years supporting deadbeat boyfriends. And often, the relationship ends, not when she gets fed up with it, but when the bum boyfriend finds a better offer and trades up leaving the girl feeling rejected and permanently emotionally attached to this guy she did everything for only to be left behind.

muscleman said:

Women, especially once they get into their 20s and get out into the real world typically start seeking a long term partner and provider. The process can be a long one depending on the woman's qualifications and this is why some people think that girls at clubs and bars are just out to have fun .... but she would NEVER sleep with a guy she didn't see (even if only subconsciously on the genetic level) as a long term provider. Yes you can be broke as hell and still land chicks, but that's due entirely to the fact that she doesn't know your situation and you gave off a positive first impression.

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I suspect that in a lot of cases the "counter examples" people give are simply cases where women display another trait or two, namely the tendency to judge based on perceived POTENTIAL and the belief they can be an agency of change in getting a guy to live up to what they believe his potential is.

The "I can fix him" game IOW.

Chicks dig broke college students ... if they're just finishing Harvard Law or Medical school for instance. They judge potential, even if it's subconscious.



Anyway, great post.

Nexus Polaris said:

If this is true, how do you explain all the loser guys.....

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This situation reeks of several things.

• I can fix him
• Misperception of potential. She thinks he's got more potential than he has.
• Most common, low self esteem on her part. Women will do as well as they can for themselves, but a girl with esteem issues will often sell herself short.
• False security. She has an emotional belief that if she does enough he won't "leave" her, whatever that means in the context of their situation.

Just my opinion.

to answer the 3 previous posts..

you are mistaken women for quality women.

You can grunt and **** bricks and get a woman. You can even get a decently good looking/hot woman

but Hot does not equal quality.


a woman worth her salt is not dating a bum sitting under a tree a day, unless he's a rich bum of course, smoking weed and not doing anything iwth himself.

A woman that works out, reads, is intelligent, has true goals and not just works a job to get by, who has producitve hobbies.. like attracts like

more than likely you are attracting women with other mental issues who is looking for someone to accecpt them. I've been there too. When i first got money I hung out at stripclubs alot. got so much ass it was insane. Ass licking hot ass. But in the end they all had one or more, usually the later, issues. I had money and was good looking. She was smoking hot but was abused as a child and just wants someone to accecpt her, and beyond that hotness she's really just an insecure little girl begging for a daddy.

a real woman won't put up with it. why? Because you are not the only man on earth. For crying out loud my GF's Ex, who is probably more AFC than any guy on this site.. she doesn't call it being an AFC of course, she calls him "spineless", IS A MILLIONARE WHO IS PRETTY FAMOUS.

While it's not all about mmoney, I'll give you that, a woman's first objective is to make sure and her offspring can be provided for. this is not a theory, this is not something that can be debated. this is common knoweldge and has been since we have walked upright.


Ovbiously it's not the money why my gF likes me or women in general (well most not all). I'm good looking. I'm smart. I have ambition. I'm the dominant person in any relationship I have. I am not bossy but there is no denying who steers the relationship, and it's me and I won't have it ohterwise. I am confident inmyself and in all situtations I'm in. I work my ass off. These are all traits I've built up in the pursit of money.

Something I did want to add that I've been thinking about that's kind of humorous is the hints women give about this type of thing. I've been analyzing my last relationship which ended a week ago and I did notice this in play (if you feel like reading for an hour it's all in my journal: http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=132749 but I'll spare the details here).

She made several hints about $ along the way. Never asked for anything, but the implications were there.

1) For my graduation present she got me a personalized ... money clip.

2) We were joking one day about how much money I could be making and if I could become a millionnaire and she goes "if you had a million bucks I would do anything you wanted".

3) When we first met and I brought her back to my [parent's] place, she later confided in me that her first impression (before I told her I live with my parents) was "no way does this kid own this house by himself".

And this was from a girl who was by no means a gold digger. She was very pragmatic. We went dutch most of the time and sometimes she'd even pay for me.

Just some food for thought. Anyone else have anything please do share.